Eldritch

She’s never survived a primary at that level, and that isn’t going to change.

It’s a paraphrasing of Orwell, not a direct quote, but sort of an amalgamation of his works.

Just society and humans. We have failed basic due diligence to tolerance consistently and often.

Yep. While she would have been preferable to Trump on every metric. You can’t fix the stupid/dishonest that is neoliberal oligarchs and their attendants.

They’re not talking about a single country, of course. Just a global disease. 🤷‍♀️

It’s worse than that.Immigration and customs enforcement are modern days brown shirts at this point. Ice is violence. That someone responded to the violence of ice with more violence was inevitable. Yet they will still try to act shocked and innocent.

Its the whole reason violence has become acceptable. Society’s duty is to ostracize and make those who espouse hate and violence, feel unwelcome. Yet society rewards those people. When peaceful change becomes impossible. Violent change becomes inevitable.

Bwang!

That and fascists and their allies own all the messaging outlets. Democrats could have perfect messaging and it would hardly reach anyone. So it really doesn’t help that their messaging is shit.

Just a friendly reminder, his current wife used to be his stepdaughter. Whom he groomed from a young age.

It’s definitely one of them.

Saturday teenage kick

Honestly, I question whether it is ever deserved. However, Charlie Kirk advocated for it, so I’m not exactly upset.

What!? Blasphemy! They’re only the best chambers ever built or conceived! I mean at the very least they’re alright, kinda.

But yes oxygen nearly wiped out all life on earth at least once.

What would shardikprime say. They got really quiet about Milei once all these receipts started rolling in

Poor kid.

It’s amazing how few people understand how dangerous oxygen can be. And of course by extension how dangerous hyperbaric chambers pressurized with it can be.

They’re nowhere near as tested or safe as hyperbolic chambers.

I just also want to say that I’m not trying to be hateful or antagonistic. And no one should be downvoting you for what you said. This is a sort of conversation that needs to be had a lot more often.

Right, but this is all probabilistic, not definitive.

We understand things and make predictions through probability daily. Probabilistic doesn’t mean indeterminable.

I wonder then what you would take, at this stage, of evidence that the killer was left wing, if not the testimony of his mother?

I think I stated it pretty clearly. Someone with demonstrable knowledge of the subject, with no need to other and blame someone else. I’d take anyone who’d been through a basic polysci course with reasonable grades over her any day of the week easily. Does it need to be pointed out that America is so uneducated. That most people who would describe themselves as being on the left in America, are solidly right wing. If people who think they’re on the left often aren’t. How likely do you think it is that people who think they’re on the right actually even a clue what on the left is?

This is the crux of my point: a bunch of people here, including you, have an incredibly high bar to believe that he’s left wing

High bar? High bar? Respectfully, do you even know what you’re talking about? The bar is so low, it’s practically subterranean. We can’t even say he even vocalized support for anyone who wasn’t a republican. Whether or not he agreed with Republicans all the time. Something you may not aware of, fascists hate each other all the time. Hating a fascist does not make you left. Feeling visceral repulsion at someone like Charlie Kirk doesn’t even make you a good person necessarily. It just makes you less maladjusted than Charlie Kirk himself.

Let me help by enumerating a few very low bars that would be acceptable. He spent a single semester at college. Did he make a lot of new friends and hang out with people who actually were leftist. (Openly anarchist, socialist, even ML would be acceptable and damning) Was he ever publicly known to possess or talk about a literature written by Marx, Engels, or other similar figures? Did he suddenly start talking often in favor of workers’ rights? The left doesn’t have a monopoly on social safety nets. But we can’t even point to him speaking positively about them. Was he in an anarchist reading group?

You’re not wrong that caution is advised. Caution is advised to never repeat the words of a fascist or any other authoritarian. Or give them credence that they might be factual or in good faith.

It sounds like you’re pretty sure that anyone who carries out a political assassination is right-wing by default, so maybe you

It only sounds that way if you put words in to people’s mouths. That they didn’t say. There absolutely can and have been people that have assassinated others from the left. But even by the report the government is trying to suppress. It was what, something close to 3x as likely for such murders to have no clear political motivation. And close to 7x more likely for them to be right wing.

[His mother] (https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/sep/16/charlie-kirk-shooting-prosecutor-utah) described him as moving to the left and becoming pro-LGBT rights

Oh, is she someone known for being educated on that subject. Or just another right wing maga indoctrinate, repeating the propaganda they’ve been told. Left and Right are about economics. Not lgbtetc. You can and many are quietly pro lgbt for themselves, while hypocritically being right wing. Till someone actually knowledgeable on the subject. With no need to misrepresent it weighs in. In my mind if it was born from a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck. Forgive me if I call it a duck.

It seems to me that the most likely motivation - such as we can judge it at this early stage - is that the killer became uncomfortable with the hatred of trans people shown by Charlie Kirk (and much of the American right).

That doesn’t a leftist make. Anarchists like myself would and do regularly tell people to get a weapon or a gun and arm themselves for self-defense. Self defence, keep that in mind. Authoritarians like fascist or Leninists are a threat to themselves and everyone around them. I don’t know where you’ve been. But it isn’t the left that’s known for calling for a second amendment solutions in America.

If that’s the case then saying “it was a right wing MAGA” is wrong and misleading

Only if you take the word of people who are well known for lying, misleading, or simply being uneducated and bigoted as gospel. Which is something I recommend you don’t do.

Came from a maga family. Solved his issue the maga way. It may be safe to say his politics had started to evolve. But it’s also safe to say he was still solidly right wing. And not left in any meaningful sense. Apart from coming to grips with his own sexuality, which his family told him made him a monster.

Conservatism is one of many things that absolutely stunts your growth as a person. And the only groups that have been pushing that he isn’t a right-wing-oid. Are the childish fascists in power that own everything. Even then, they’ve been struggling.Don’t believe them.

Now, while all these people are at least superficially right wing. They certainly aren’t principled or ideological right-wingers.As has been seen many times over. When you poll them about left leaning issues without framing them as being left leaning. They are often for them. But they are still superficially and intractibly right wing. Even in my own home, I cannot escape right-wing propaganda if I use the internet, television or radio. Americans are cocooned into fascist propaganda from the moment they step out their front doors.