The current state American society has been in for the last 10 to 15 years is heavily a consequence of Russian info ops. Many countries run info ops. But no country has done as much damage as Russia
No other country has done as much? We’re gonna just ignore how much support Israel has thrown behind Trump? Netanyahu was meeting and communicating with him during the 2024 election cycle, all while ignoring the Biden administration! Snubbing a sitting president for a prospective candidate!
Yeah, no. American Oligarchs did social media. Youtube, Twitter, facebook, instagram all American. First they did it for money now they are doing it openly for power. Cambridge Analytica, anti-vax, anti-trans, anti-abortion, anti-immigrant all of these are made by Americans to poison the world. And they are going to do much worse with AI. Americans destroyed the world.
Corporate control over an algorithm that decides who is served what content is a platform-agnostic tool of power over society. We’re seeing that danger manifest in old and new ways every single day. That lever of power allows whomever owns that particular medium to push whatever content they like. That is the entire motivation behind and purpose of the Fediverse and other decentralization efforts.
Zuck and muskrat separate populations, push propaganda and influence discussions at an unprecedented level. The control a single corporation, a single authoritarian point of power has over such vast swathes of population dwarfs the propagandic power of Goebbles and Stalin by an order of magnitude or more.
I don’t blame America explicitly like the other commenter. The conditions that have allowed the billionaire class to explode and wield power and influence exist elsewhere in the world as well. That said, America’s legal and regulatory frameworks did provide particularly fertile breeding grounds for the exploitation and hoarding of capital that produces billionaires.
Yea naw, my parents watch WeChat short videos and read their BS articles and they constantly regurgitate anti-Democrat rhetorics, and whenever someone gets shot by police, they fucking cheer, the homeless people, anyone with a “mental illness”, even George Floyd, they think trials are waste of time and resources, they want the system to just skip the trial and want the suspects dead.
Can’t even blame “Americans” for this, the CCP has full control of the content, they clearly aren’t censoring it.
WeChat is literally poisoning the Chinese Overseas Diaspora. Its another tentacle of the CCP’s power. There’s no doubt they also infect social media platforms like facebook, xitter, etc…They sow chaos, and untimately, whatever the CCP does damages the repututation of anyone who is ethnic Chinese or looks ethnic Chinese. They are infaming Sinophobia by being the worse representatives of my people. And all the abuse that I have endured from my parents is from this toxic culture, fuck this “filial piety” BS, fuck conservatism. I’ve been helping out in my parents bussiness, and they still say I’m useless. I really wanna go back in time and shoot confucious for inventing the stupid ass religion, fuck your 孝順, its literally parental indoctrination to control their children. Evil ass shit. Fuck confucious.
I assumed the US was disseminating right-wing propaganda among the chinese diaspora, given that they do it with every other one.
What does China even get out of turning your parents into right-wing psychos? America gets a community that is happy to work with them against their home country.
Andrew Wakefield, the guy who started the antivax movement, is British
anti-trans,
The US passed laws protecting trans people and many Americans are literally trans or allies. Russia however, is extremely anti-trans.
anti-abortion,
See the above point
anti-immigrant
See the above point, also, America is a country of immigrants and refugees, “Melting Pot,” America was one of the first countries to encourage and mobilize massive movements of immigrants, which sheltered them from oppressive governments looking to hurt them. This includes people fleeing from Russia and their wars and genocides like the Holodomor.
I have no issue with Russian people, I have an issue with Putin and the Russian state government committing atrocities globally including usurping governments. I am not a liberal, I am an abolitionist and socialist.
Whether you acknowledge it or not, their bombs will blow you up the same.
Lmfao it isn’t xenophobia to stand up to a nation or nations actively attacking you with huge military campaigns for millions of dollars. It isnt xenophobia to criticize a foreign government engaging in massive human rights abuses including slavery.
Where have I stated American exceptionalism even once?
Where have I stated anything McCarthyism related? Do you think modern Russia is communist? Do you think Putin is communist?
Can you say anything negative about Putin?
No shit, I don’t support the US doing this shit either.
my sibling in Christ, Reps. Mace and Jackson literally shouted the t-slur yesterday and called for all trans people to be forcibly institutionalized. Trump said he “wouldn’t oppose” banning the trans flag when a reporter asked about “transtifa.” Musk retweeted someone who called trans women “perverted, deranged bioweapons” and trans men “osteoporotic, androgynous goblins,” calling us to be contained and forbidden to communicate with each other. along with someone else calling for a total ban on HRT for all ages. we’ve been kicked out of the military, and stripped of security clearances. the DoJ has floated banning us from gun ownership by ruling that we’re “mentally defective.” my passport has an M on it because Trump reverted all the rules on his first day in office. it’s a literal felony for trans women to use the women’s bathroom in Florida, and for trans office workers to use their own pronouns. coverage for trans health has been stripped from nearly every public service. trans protections have recently been eviscerated in Skrmetti.
They are not America even if they seized fascist control of America. America is the people here and that includes activists and trans people. That includes you and me.
That we cry out and care is evidence the universe cries out and cares, since we are part of the universe as well. The universe through us cries out.
That we cry out and care is evidence Americans care, because we are both Americans. It is so so so important to not equate America with hate, but instead to equate the MAGA admin with hate.
And regardless, those anti-trans laws are literally Putin/Russian as a policy - remember how Russia got mad at the Olympic boxer and demanded she be tested? Russia literally funded the politicians for those laws, made all the propaganda pieces and ads, etc etc etc. And ofc some traitors and assholes went with it.
Literally just reinventing the Nazis conspiracy theory that Russians are secretly behind all their nations problems.
They are not America
You are literally arguing that literal birth American citizens living in America aren’t really American and are actually “Russian” in some kind of ontological way. You have literally defined ‘Russian’ and ‘American’ in such a way that all of America’s problems are, by definition Russia, even if they are caused entirely by American policy made by Americans in America. This is hardcore literal Nazi shit you are doing.
Yes, the solution to America’s problems is more centralized government control of information, to make sure that those evil ruskies can’t corrupt our pure bodily fluids internet.
I think you need a nap or something, because what you said isn’t anything I wrote.
First, the existence of the post office doesn’t stop you from using UPS or Fedex. Likewise, a government forum wouldn’t stop you from using other forums or social. And the government already got involved in socials like TikTok (deal currently being made), Truth Social, Twitter, and Meta - but because they aren’t explicitly OWNED by the government, we don’t have the same legal protections and cannot sue for rights that would normally be protected like free speech.
Just like how USPS can’t open packages without a warrant, but UPS and Fedex can just open whatever. The government gives you special protections that you can enforce via lawsuits.
The government would actually be losing control of information compared to the level they currently have it at. And so would advertisers and propagandists, because it would be much harder to make sock puppets and bots. FYI propaganda warfare is literally NOT democracy, it’s fascism and fascist control of info. We should each get a say, and what we say should stand on merit, not money. We deserve real communication so we can work on issues.
I already explained I love the Russian people, but not their fascist government.
Starting with an insult, as all bad faith arguers do.
because what you said isn’t anything I wrote.
It is what they call “paraphrasing”
The government would actually be losing control of information compared to the level they currently have it at. And so would advertisers and propagandists
So who would be moderating this government forum?
FYI propaganda warfare is literally NOT democracy
It literally is though, certainly under capitalism, at least: propaganda is how you convince people to vote for the policies you want/represent.
it’s fascism and fascist control of info.
Yeah, no one other than fascists have ever engaged in propaganda…
You did not paraphrase, you made up an entirely different thing that was never said by me.
Say something negative about Putin.
The government moderates it along with the laws we put into place that protect us. Again, they are already doing this without the laws or transparency via private businesses.
Propaganda WARFARE is new, mostly online, and hasn’t been used like this before ~2016. It is NOT democracy to hear a select few people’s opinion over and over again.
Capitalism is inherently fascist, see The Rise and Fall of the Neoliberal World Order by Gerstle. It cannot be truly democratic due to its inherent fascism, and part of that is the relentless propaganda used during capitalism via commercials, media, etc to sway people from freely consenting and critically thinking. People don’t need “propaganda” to learn about policies, they can watch town halls, debates, talks, etc, discuss them with each other, and freely exchange ideas. (Doesn’t surprise me at all that you are in support of fascist control of info).
Propaganda warfare is literally fascism, made by fascists, to spread fascism.
Strawman: Misrepresenting someones point as a different, less strong, point.
Paraphrasing: Expressing the same concept in different wording.
Hence why I was paraphrasing, because I didn’t misrepresent your point.
Say something negative about Putin.
Are you going to do this on every post now? Do you need me to recite the pledge of allegiance every post too? Say something negative about Barack Obama.
The government moderates it
Ok. So it’s information control by the government.
Propaganda WARFARE is new, mostly online, and hasn’t been used like this before ~2016.
Lol. Yeah ok. I’m not sure who you’re expecting is going to take seriously the idea that propaganda campaigns weren’t invented until decades after the cold war.
Capitalism is inherently fascist, see The Rise and Fall of the Neoliberal World Order by Gerstle. It cannot be truly democratic due to its inherent fascism, and part of that is the relentless propaganda used during capitalism via commercials, media, etc to sway people from freely consenting and critically thinking.
No disagreement here; but surely you realize this also means that control of information by a capitalist government isn’t the solution.
Propaganda warfare is literally fascism, made by fascists, to spread fascism.
Just because fascists use propaganda doesn’t’ mean that they invented it or only they use it.
Hey can you say something negative about Putin?
Wow, so you’re not just going to ask this every post, you’re going to ask it multiple times per post. Do you need me to sign a loyalty pledge too? Swear under oath that I am not and have never been a member of the communist party?
A strawman is taking someone’s genuine argument and then distorting or misrepresenting it to make it easier to attack. A strawman argument isn’t valid and it isn’t paraphrasing. Generally when people paraphrase in good faith, they will ask if they said the paraphrase correctly and will correct themselves if it is incorrect.
They cannot remove just anything, they have to have a legal basis to do so and can be sued, less government control than now.
I said propaganda warfare, meaning online propaganda warfare that started in 2016, a new type of warfare. Obviously.
Again, it is less control than what exists presently already via private companies that would still exist later anyway. We still can advocate for progress even within capitalism and fascism, that’s how we dig out of both.
Propaganda warfare in my comment is specifically referencing online warfare since 2016, and it is absolutely Putin’s baby.
You did slightly better on this comment in terms of nonsensical spewing, nice
I’ve got to ask the liberals of this com: are you really not at all uncomfortable that the liberal discourse has descended to the level of the absolute toxic insanity of the above post? Like, honest question, how is this any different to the average MAGA chud at this point?
The current state American society has been in for the last 10 to 15 years is heavily a consequence of Russian info ops. Many countries run info ops. But no country has done as much damage as Russia
No other country has done as much? We’re gonna just ignore how much support Israel has thrown behind Trump? Netanyahu was meeting and communicating with him during the 2024 election cycle, all while ignoring the Biden administration! Snubbing a sitting president for a prospective candidate!
The trick is, every-time it looks like someone other than Russia is behind it, you just have to argue that Russia is secretly being them!
Yeah, no. American Oligarchs did social media. Youtube, Twitter, facebook, instagram all American. First they did it for money now they are doing it openly for power. Cambridge Analytica, anti-vax, anti-trans, anti-abortion, anti-immigrant all of these are made by Americans to poison the world. And they are going to do much worse with AI. Americans destroyed the world.
You understand the difference between a medium and the content on that medium right?
That’s a rhetorical question since you clearly don’t.
Corporate control over an algorithm that decides who is served what content is a platform-agnostic tool of power over society. We’re seeing that danger manifest in old and new ways every single day. That lever of power allows whomever owns that particular medium to push whatever content they like. That is the entire motivation behind and purpose of the Fediverse and other decentralization efforts.
Zuck and muskrat separate populations, push propaganda and influence discussions at an unprecedented level. The control a single corporation, a single authoritarian point of power has over such vast swathes of population dwarfs the propagandic power of Goebbles and Stalin by an order of magnitude or more.
I don’t blame America explicitly like the other commenter. The conditions that have allowed the billionaire class to explode and wield power and influence exist elsewhere in the world as well. That said, America’s legal and regulatory frameworks did provide particularly fertile breeding grounds for the exploitation and hoarding of capital that produces billionaires.
Do you? Control over the medium is far more powerful than being a mere user of that medium.
Yea naw, my parents watch WeChat short videos and read their BS articles and they constantly regurgitate anti-Democrat rhetorics, and whenever someone gets shot by police, they fucking cheer, the homeless people, anyone with a “mental illness”, even George Floyd, they think trials are waste of time and resources, they want the system to just skip the trial and want the suspects dead.Can’t even blame “Americans” for this, the CCP has full control of the content, they clearly aren’t censoring it.WeChat is literally poisoning the Chinese Overseas Diaspora. Its another tentacle of the CCP’s power. There’s no doubt they also infect social media platforms like facebook, xitter, etc…They sow chaos, and untimately, whatever the CCP does damages the repututation of anyone who is ethnic Chinese or looks ethnic Chinese. They are infaming Sinophobia by being the worse representatives of my people. And all the abuse that I have endured from my parents is from this toxic culture, fuck this “filial piety” BS, fuck conservatism. I’ve been helping out in my parents bussiness, and they still say I’m useless. I really wanna go back in time and shoot confucious for inventing the stupid ass religion, fuck your 孝順, its literally parental indoctrination to control their children. Evil ass shit. Fuck confucious.Nvm
I assumed the US was disseminating right-wing propaganda among the chinese diaspora, given that they do it with every other one.
What does China even get out of turning your parents into right-wing psychos? America gets a community that is happy to work with them against their home country.
deleted by creator
I’m sorry for that. If its any consolation, the dynamics usually change as they get older and more dependent on you.
That’s British
Andrew Wakefield, the guy who started the antivax movement, is British
The US passed laws protecting trans people and many Americans are literally trans or allies. Russia however, is extremely anti-trans.
See the above point
See the above point, also, America is a country of immigrants and refugees, “Melting Pot,” America was one of the first countries to encourage and mobilize massive movements of immigrants, which sheltered them from oppressive governments looking to hurt them. This includes people fleeing from Russia and their wars and genocides like the Holodomor.
ahh, to live in 2014 again.
It’s still here in 2025. America isn’t a bunch of fascist MAGAs, even if we are being taken over by Russian assets and Russian propaganda.
You know America is cooked because even liberals are blaming everything on evil foreigners
I have no issue with Russian people, I have an issue with Putin and the Russian state government committing atrocities globally including usurping governments. I am not a liberal, I am an abolitionist and socialist.
Whether you acknowledge it or not, their bombs will blow you up the same.
No. This level of xenophobia, American exceptionalism, and McCarthyism are incompatible with actually being an abolitionist and a socialist.
All bombs will blow you up, genius, including American ones, which blow up more people than anyone else.
Lmfao it isn’t xenophobia to stand up to a nation or nations actively attacking you with huge military campaigns for millions of dollars. It isnt xenophobia to criticize a foreign government engaging in massive human rights abuses including slavery.
Where have I stated American exceptionalism even once?
Where have I stated anything McCarthyism related? Do you think modern Russia is communist? Do you think Putin is communist?
Can you say anything negative about Putin?
No shit, I don’t support the US doing this shit either.
my sibling in Christ, Reps. Mace and Jackson literally shouted the t-slur yesterday and called for all trans people to be forcibly institutionalized. Trump said he “wouldn’t oppose” banning the trans flag when a reporter asked about “transtifa.” Musk retweeted someone who called trans women “perverted, deranged bioweapons” and trans men “osteoporotic, androgynous goblins,” calling us to be contained and forbidden to communicate with each other. along with someone else calling for a total ban on HRT for all ages. we’ve been kicked out of the military, and stripped of security clearances. the DoJ has floated banning us from gun ownership by ruling that we’re “mentally defective.” my passport has an M on it because Trump reverted all the rules on his first day in office. it’s a literal felony for trans women to use the women’s bathroom in Florida, and for trans office workers to use their own pronouns. coverage for trans health has been stripped from nearly every public service. trans protections have recently been eviscerated in Skrmetti.
it’s really not going great.
They are not America even if they seized fascist control of America. America is the people here and that includes activists and trans people. That includes you and me.
That we cry out and care is evidence the universe cries out and cares, since we are part of the universe as well. The universe through us cries out.
That we cry out and care is evidence Americans care, because we are both Americans. It is so so so important to not equate America with hate, but instead to equate the MAGA admin with hate.
And regardless, those anti-trans laws are literally Putin/Russian as a policy - remember how Russia got mad at the Olympic boxer and demanded she be tested? Russia literally funded the politicians for those laws, made all the propaganda pieces and ads, etc etc etc. And ofc some traitors and assholes went with it.
Literally just reinventing the Nazis conspiracy theory that Russians are secretly behind all their nations problems.
You are literally arguing that literal birth American citizens living in America aren’t really American and are actually “Russian” in some kind of ontological way. You have literally defined ‘Russian’ and ‘American’ in such a way that all of America’s problems are, by definition Russia, even if they are caused entirely by American policy made by Americans in America. This is hardcore literal Nazi shit you are doing.
No, and further, I gave sources. From multiple countries and organizations and world leaders. https://lemmy.world/post/36107411/19469733
We need a national online forum
Yes, the solution to America’s problems is more centralized government control of information, to make sure that those evil ruskies can’t corrupt our pure
bodily fluidsinternet.I think you need a nap or something, because what you said isn’t anything I wrote.
First, the existence of the post office doesn’t stop you from using UPS or Fedex. Likewise, a government forum wouldn’t stop you from using other forums or social. And the government already got involved in socials like TikTok (deal currently being made), Truth Social, Twitter, and Meta - but because they aren’t explicitly OWNED by the government, we don’t have the same legal protections and cannot sue for rights that would normally be protected like free speech.
Just like how USPS can’t open packages without a warrant, but UPS and Fedex can just open whatever. The government gives you special protections that you can enforce via lawsuits.
The government would actually be losing control of information compared to the level they currently have it at. And so would advertisers and propagandists, because it would be much harder to make sock puppets and bots. FYI propaganda warfare is literally NOT democracy, it’s fascism and fascist control of info. We should each get a say, and what we say should stand on merit, not money. We deserve real communication so we can work on issues.
I already explained I love the Russian people, but not their fascist government.
Grow up and argue in good faith, ya piece of shit
Starting with an insult, as all bad faith arguers do.
It is what they call “paraphrasing”
So who would be moderating this government forum?
It literally is though, certainly under capitalism, at least: propaganda is how you convince people to vote for the policies you want/represent.
Yeah, no one other than fascists have ever engaged in propaganda…
🙄
Define “strawman” and define “paraphrasing.”
You did not paraphrase, you made up an entirely different thing that was never said by me.
Say something negative about Putin.
The government moderates it along with the laws we put into place that protect us. Again, they are already doing this without the laws or transparency via private businesses.
Propaganda WARFARE is new, mostly online, and hasn’t been used like this before ~2016. It is NOT democracy to hear a select few people’s opinion over and over again.
Capitalism is inherently fascist, see The Rise and Fall of the Neoliberal World Order by Gerstle. It cannot be truly democratic due to its inherent fascism, and part of that is the relentless propaganda used during capitalism via commercials, media, etc to sway people from freely consenting and critically thinking. People don’t need “propaganda” to learn about policies, they can watch town halls, debates, talks, etc, discuss them with each other, and freely exchange ideas. (Doesn’t surprise me at all that you are in support of fascist control of info).
Propaganda warfare is literally fascism, made by fascists, to spread fascism.
Hey can you say something negative about Putin?
Strawman: Misrepresenting someones point as a different, less strong, point. Paraphrasing: Expressing the same concept in different wording.
Hence why I was paraphrasing, because I didn’t misrepresent your point.
Are you going to do this on every post now? Do you need me to recite the pledge of allegiance every post too? Say something negative about Barack Obama.
Ok. So it’s information control by the government.
Lol. Yeah ok. I’m not sure who you’re expecting is going to take seriously the idea that propaganda campaigns weren’t invented until decades after the cold war.
No disagreement here; but surely you realize this also means that control of information by a capitalist government isn’t the solution.
Just because fascists use propaganda doesn’t’ mean that they invented it or only they use it.
Wow, so you’re not just going to ask this every post, you’re going to ask it multiple times per post. Do you need me to sign a loyalty pledge too? Swear under oath that I am not and have never been a member of the communist party?
A strawman is taking someone’s genuine argument and then distorting or misrepresenting it to make it easier to attack. A strawman argument isn’t valid and it isn’t paraphrasing. Generally when people paraphrase in good faith, they will ask if they said the paraphrase correctly and will correct themselves if it is incorrect.
They cannot remove just anything, they have to have a legal basis to do so and can be sued, less government control than now.
I said propaganda warfare, meaning online propaganda warfare that started in 2016, a new type of warfare. Obviously.
Again, it is less control than what exists presently already via private companies that would still exist later anyway. We still can advocate for progress even within capitalism and fascism, that’s how we dig out of both.
Propaganda warfare in my comment is specifically referencing online warfare since 2016, and it is absolutely Putin’s baby.
You did slightly better on this comment in terms of nonsensical spewing, nice
I’ve got to ask the liberals of this com: are you really not at all uncomfortable that the liberal discourse has descended to the level of the absolute toxic insanity of the above post? Like, honest question, how is this any different to the average MAGA chud at this point?